response 1 of 24:

Mar 16 22:53 UTC 2007

Workplace violence is the #1 cause of death for women at work and the #2 cause
for men.  This means: Men can run faster

response 3 of 24:

Mar 17 12:48 UTC 2007

re #2
Actually, the most hazardous jobs out there are timber, crab fishing, and
commercial pilot IN ALASKA.  Seeing as I don't know anyone in Alaska besides
mcnally, though...

response 5 of 24:

Mar 19 21:13 UTC 2007

er s/sometime/something

response 7 of 24:

Mar 19 21:23 UTC 2007

Oh yeah. I live in Ypsilanti and I hang out in Depot Town. 

response 9 of 24:

Mar 22 11:24 UTC 2007

It has often puzzled me why we require physical fitness testing to join police
and fire departments, but don't continue to require reasonable levels of
fitness afterwards.

response 11 of 24:

Mar 24 07:17 UTC 2007

I recall NPR mentioning that most fire fighters are volunteers, so
their "employers" are in a poor position to tell anyone to stay in 
shape, and not offering any health plan that might pay attention to 
(let along try to improve) cardio risks & fitness.

Even where the fire fighters are full-time, paid, and don't have a
union to "protect" them, how many municipalities are sophisticated
and prosperous enough to sustain an effective, pro-active employee
health program?  I'd guess it's pretty close to zero. 

Flip-side, paid fire fighters dying of heart attacks are exercising
their sacred freedoms, freeing the taxpayers from a huge liability
for future pension & health benefits, and providing public funerals
where politicians can look good praising the fallen heros.  Clearly
this is a win-win-win situation. 

response 13 of 24:

Mar 25 03:00 UTC 2007

If there is/was some sort of periodic professional certification that
fire fighters needed, then maybe it could include a cardio fitness
minimum.  Nothing in my femto-fact knowledge base suggests such to be 
the case.

response 15 of 24:

Mar 25 13:57 UTC 2007

I know my Dad mentioned that for years the test kept most women from
being firefighters because part of the test was to carry a heavy dummy
up a ladder three stories which only the very strongest women could do.
But then someone sued a department or something and pointed out that the
circumstances where anyone would need to rescue someone else and carry
them *UP* a ladder three stories is rare indeed, since most buildings
dont have that many sub basements. 

response 17 of 24:

Mar 26 03:02 UTC 2007

My teen-years hometown was a bedroom community.  They got the recruit-
women religion when they noticed that most of their volunteer fire
fighters worked in (relatively) distant places, leaving the township
SOL during business hours.  Stay-at-home housewives turned fireladies
seemed more retro (a la Rosie the Riveter) than modern, somehow.

response 19 of 24:

Mar 28 15:46 UTC 2007

They why have a physical fitness test in the first place?

response 21 of 24:

Mar 28 18:36 UTC 2007

Right. That is a good reason to have a fitness test in the first place. 
It is also a good reason to continue to have fitness tests

response 23 of 24:

Mar 28 23:18 UTC 2007

I called my Dad and he said that the reason Fire Departments dont 
continue to require fitness tests is because of their unions. He also 
mentioned that fire fighters unions are very powerful politically so it 
is very unlikely that any government body will ever be able to require 
fitness tests for even their paid firefighters. They require fitness 
tests in order to obtain employment because that is the only time 
management can do that because people seeking employment are not 
members of the union. 


He said that a lot of unions have negotiated deals where any heart 
problem is automatically duty caused and thus eligible for disability 
pay. He said that firefighters who die do not save much in future 
benefits because unions have negotiated pretty big benefit packages. It 
would be normal for the heirs of a dead firefighter to get $250,000 in 
addition to continued pension and health benefits for their families. 
Also, while firefighters dying of heart conditions might be a problem, 
a bigger problem is firefighters who develop heart conditions but who 
dont die. They essentially retire with disability pay. That might not 
have been a huge problem in the past when people with heart disease 
could be expected to die quickly but these days, people live decades 
after having heart attacks and such. 

The thing of it is that it really isnt an old person's job. It is the 
kind of physically demanding job that maybe should have an age 
limitation. But of course, age discrimination is illegal (as it should 
be imho. If firefighters want to take the risk of occupational heart 
problems...more power to 'em. )